MTSS 3: The Older Boyfriend

You’re 15. He’s 25. No problem, right?

135 Responses to “MTSS 3: The Older Boyfriend”

  1. 1 Alicia

    This is a great idea and a great thing to have for kids my age.
    AND My god you don’t even know how many times I’ve tried to tell my friends about the topic of your show today… 18+ guys dating 16- girls = LOSERS.


  2. 2 J Storm

    Um, I think you goofed big time with this episode.

    You did everything to drive your intended audience away from your message. You mocked them and insulted the person they are with. Instead of the real reasons why such relationships are exploitive and wrong, you chose to trot out jokes about internet nerds and incest.

    The worst moment was your pedophile comment. The girls in question see themselves as “more mature”, and not as little girls. Calling pedophilia a disease in this context is like telling such girls that the desire to date them is a disease.

    And you discard all moral high ground with the statement “Would you date someone with cancer? No?” Is dating someone with cancer wrong or exploitive? God help you if one of these exploited girls actually HAS cancer.

    Your prior two episodes were good ones, where the humor complemented the message. Here, you let the jokes take over, forgetting that the jokes you were using sabotaged the primary message.

    I’d probably complain that by only focusing on older “boyfriends” ignores the older-female / teen relationships that should also be of concern, but that’s merely an omission, and not every episode can cover the entirety of an issue.

    Let this be a constructive criticism. You really need to go back to the drawing board on this episode. It will probably backfire in getting girls being exploited to recognize that fact.

  3. 3 Gina

    OMG, you are kidding! The cancer stuff was funny. I thought she was joking, right? Was I the onely one who tought she was joking?
    Anways i have a friend who is dating this one guy who is 25 and it seems gross because isn’t that when people start looking for marrages? He would seem nice if i din’t know he was having sex with a 16 yr old girl.

  4. 4 Crabby Dude


    “The girls in question see themselves as “more mature”, and not as little girls. Calling pedophilia a disease in this context is like telling such girls that the desire to date them is a disease.”

    So, are you saying that it’s okay for older men/women to desire younger people, simply because we shouldn’t risk offending the younger party to believe that somehow it’s wrong to do so?

    Come on, it’s both creepy and just plain wrong for older men/women to want to date underagers because 99% of them only want to get laid, and they’ll say anything to do it. Show me some solid evidence of people in their mid 20s and above who have dated people between the ages of 12 and 16 who have had solid, loving relationships that weren’t based solely on the older party taking advantage of the younger to fill their desire for younger ass.

    Nobody in the show was saying that the younger party needs to feel it’s wrong that THEY THEMSELVES should be desired. Where the hell did that assumption come from? If you believe that somehow a man/woman of 30 can find the personality and charm of a 15-year-old to be so stunning that they aren’t even thinking about the sexual aspect, then I’ve got a bridge I’d like to sell you.

    If you’re way older than the underage person you’re persuing, you’re either a freakin’ pedophile, or, just such a doofus that you can’t score with someone who actually wants to know that the person with can truly take care of them. When you’re 15, an older guy/girl with their own place and some money to throw around seems like they’re cool and totally grown-up, even if they’re living in a van down by the river and selling crack to make ends meet.

    Maybe we need to actually teach our kids what’s right and what’s wrong so they won’t look for the love of an older figure to be their lover / caretaker. The show isn’t responsible for instilling proper values - that’s your job and that of every other parent out there. The show has every right to say that it’s a bad idea to give your booty up to someone way older than you - that’s common sense, and if it takes a bit of humor for teenagers to get the hint because parents didn’t get the message through, then mad props to them for making it a point of discussion. If mom and dad weren’t so intent on getting the kids out of their hair and would spend more time getting to know them and helping them learn how to stay out of bad situations, we wouldn’t have such a strong need for shows like this to do the job for them. Go MTSS!

  5. 5 Nikol

    I love you. All of you. Crabby Dude, you have made my night. Thank you for such positive words.

    And J Storm, we are listening. We accepted at this show’s conception that not all of our jokes would sit well. I would totally date someone with cancer, as long as they weren’t a teen.

    Alicia and Gina, we implore you to send us emails with more info about what you want us to discuss.

  6. 6 RJ

    Hi Nikol,

    I produce and direct ‘Talk Sex with Sue Johanson’, so sexuality and broadcasting is a topic I am very familiar with. A friend sent me to your site, and I thought the first two episodes were excellent. But, I’m with J Storm on the third installment - I thought that equating a psychiatric disorder with cancer was misleading and, frankly, downright mean. That one gag got the better of you and ruined the intended message. From my own experience, this is where input from others can be very helpful.

    Other than that quibble, I thought the presentation and information was terrific, and I even laughed at the ‘dry soil’ gag in the clitoris hunt. Keep up the great work!

  7. 7 C-Della

    I think there is humor in everything. Cancer may be a serious topic, but they didn’t mean it at all. Why are people not seeing that it was a joke? Why do people laugh at some of the jokes, but take the others seriously. Even the serious stuff here is supposed to be funny.

    You should just say that you didn’t think it was funny, not get all “people with cancer should would be hurt by that” about it. It was a joke and I thought it was pretty funny.

    I Love Sue Johansen!

  8. 8 nikol

    We have received a bit of wisdom from a fine source. Dr. David Hersh has begun to communicate with me on some of the more serious aspects of what we are doing here. He took strong issue with our use of the term pedophile, which is incorrect.

    He has provided me with the following quote:

    “…(A)nother entrenched notion sorely in need of examination: that men are attracted to younger women because they “have less power.” I would like to suggest, first, that men are not attracted to “younger” women, but that they are attracted to “young” women. That is, boys of age 12 and 13 are maximally attracted to older women (e.g. 17-24 or thereabouts), 17-24 year-old men are maximally attracted to 17-24 year old women, and 24-94 year-old men are *also*maximally attracted to 17-24 year-old women. “If men were looking for women with less power, they would be maximally attracted to lower social status, poorer, less physically attractive (i.e. older, “androgenized”, and asymmetrical) women. However, this is clearly not the case. If we define power as the ability to effect one’s will, it
    is clear that beautiful young women have more power than other women (with the possible exception of the very few extremely wealthy women or women entrenched in powerful corporate positions).” Paul Okami

  9. 9 Jeffe

    hmm, well honestly a 16 year old girl wouldnt date someone with cancer, not for long anyway. Maybe rickets would have been better for some folks or um scabies, or just flesh eating virus, but this touches on some serious stuff. In my experience though and I hope you guys do a show on this most of the girls I have met who dated people really outside their age group were sexually abused. That experience made them try to deal with their abuse by re-exploring it subconsciously with an older person. Good for you though calling it a disease by the way. It is pedophilia for a 20+ year old to be dating a 16 year old and it really does call into question what that persons motives are.

    Also great show…

  10. 10 J Storm

    “So, are you saying that it’s okay for older men/women to desire younger people, simply because we shouldn’t risk offending the younger party to believe that somehow it’s wrong to do so?”


    I’m saying that messages that are more likely to anger someone you are trying to help are more likely to be ignored.

    It’s not that the topic shouldn’t be addressed, it’s how the message is executed.

    That said. I like the premise of the show. It’s just that the rare “you shouldn’t” topic within an otherwise sex-positive show has an extra responsibility to better communicate WHY something is a bad idea (which I think was a bigger problem than the poorly targeted humor). Otherwise you risk being as effective as right-wing moralists preaching against teen sex.

  11. 11 Billy Hoffman

    I love these podcasts. They are brilliant! But what I love more is Britney and her delicious blouse bunnies. Keep up the good work.

    Britney’s best wedding date ever

  12. 12 soupbadger

    I for one would not date anyone with cancer, especially if they had a sense of humor. Having a sense of humor is SO last decade. Anyway, dropping the sarcasm, I like the videos so far. All [three] of them have made me laugh very hard. Great job and thanks.

  13. 13 jamie

    Actually the cancer part is where i laughed the most…
    cause its true.. do you know any 12-17 year olds that would? Probably not.
    I love the show guys, keep up the awesome work!

  14. 14 Jenn E

    Hey! I found you guys through Sex Is Fun, what an awesome show! You do a great job of covering topics in a way that is funny and isn’t condescending. As for the cancer thing–eh, maybe a faux pas, but I wasn’t offended, personally. Maybe you should’ve gone with leprosy? Or an STI? Anyway, I could’ve used this advice when I was 15 and dating a 20 year old… now that I’m 22, the idea of dating a 17 year old is just gross. Anyway, awesome job, keep up the good work! Nikol, you rock!

    P.S. RJ–Sue Johansen almost single-handedly taught me about sex when I was a teen, I loved The Sunday Night Sex Show!

  15. 15 Zpoy

    This show was hilarious! I agree that girls shouldnt date someone 20 or 30 when they’re in highschool. About the cancer thing, that was really funny. I understand why people are getting angry about it but they need to be quiet. Keep up the great work, your show is great!

  16. 16 aRandomGuy

    Just a few things I have to say from the male perspective…I am 21 years old, the way I see it any girl around 18 or younger is way too young to have any kind of relationship or snything with. Any guy in his 20s willing to date a girl in her young teens is either really messed up or just really desperate. About the cancer thing, I know 2 people close to me that have died from it and 1 person that has survived it…doesn’t make me laugh when its joked about. It’s good though to have something out there telling young girls to watch out for the older guys…they need to stick to there age group and realize how bad of a person they are if they are with some really young girl

  17. 17 Me

    I thought the cancer bit was a little off.

    Otherwise, pretty good.

  18. 18 Steven

    It’s sad that there are a lot of girls who are with these older guys.
    I mean older guys who date younger girls is pretty lame and
    those guys need to grow a set and start looking for someone
    their own age. A lot of girls don’t realize that the older guy
    is gonna have the most control in the relationship and that type of
    control isn’t the best in my perspective. Trust me they will mold you
    into the type of person they want you to be!
    These girls need to realize that these guys have already lived
    their lives and they are already set in their own mind and are
    just looking for someone they can control.

    but yes really good episode. lol love you birtney your hilarious. nikol you rock! great job n_n

  19. 19 PrelKikam

    enter text? test, sorry


  20. 20 Rick

    “If you’re a junior and you’re dating someone who’s out of high-school, he’s a pedophile. And pedophilia is a disease. Would you date someone with cancer?”

    The problem with the ‘cancer’ reference is that while it may (may) have been meant as a joke, it isn’t presented as one. If it was meant to be sarcasm then it was used to reinforce that the previous comment was also a joke.

    For example, by saying “Station wagons are cool and George Bush is a genius” we’re making *sure* you understand that the station wagon reference was a joke by joining it to a statement that is even more obviously a joke.

    Now let’s change that first thing to something serious: “Drugs are bad and George Bush is a genius”. See what happened? We’ve now cast aspersions on the first statement by our use of the second.

    “Don’t date a pedophile. You wouldn’t date someone with cancer”

    To those who (probably correctly) point out that a teen girl is not going to date someone with cancer: That doesn’t matter. This clip presents dating someone with cancer as the near equivalent to dating a pedophile.

    The first two eps were fantastic and this third was too .. except for the poorly thought-through cancer reference.

    To Nikol et al: Please keep up the good work, your frank, open discussions contain so many good nuggets in such a digestible manner and are so watchable.

    Rick Measham

  21. 21 Marley

    It depends on whom is involved in the “younger/older relationship scenario”. It has been known to work out well, and not just ending terribly. However, as with most things, the bad aspects are always more popular. It does indeed take a lot of maturity [Although, not the common delusional teen maturity], as well as dedication. Most, not all, teenagers don’t really fancy that sort of commitment at such a young age. Not that that’s wrong. It’s very normal. I’m just saying that it’s possible for a younger/older relationship to work, and without a purely sexual agenda. I just have to post my opinion because at times I come across this sort of thing, and I feel a bit offended. Thank you all for listening.

    I would like to note that I am the younger aspect in the relationship.

  22. 22 Millard

    Two Words… Millard Fillmore
    former President… married his teacher… nuff said

  23. 23 Fred X. Quinby

    In the interest of equal time, you should do an episode on teen boys dating older women.

    On second thought no. Millard Fillmore was right, these hawt sekrets should be kept to ourselves.

  24. 24 Krister Svanlund


    Third time… please admins remove my former messages…

    “Aww, this episode destroyed my whole image of this show… Pedophilia is attraction to preteen kids… a 25 year old with a -16 year old (no matter which is a male or female) is hebephilia.

    And what does it matter if someone has cancer?”

  25. 25 sam

    yeah, the joke about cancer wasn’t funny, satirical, or ironic in any way.

  26. 26 Alex

    Awesome advice. Simple rule: Don’t date people who are older because you think it will make you feel cool and because he can buy you stuff. Stay away from the types of people who you might accompany on Jerry Springer. Just a thought.

    And Nicole instead of jokes about cancer, here are some suggestions:
    Elephant man’s disease
    Congenital posion ivy
    and anything that Cartman might get.

    Good show.

  27. 27 Justin

    Something that just sticks in my craw (along with a ton of other ‘liberal crazy’ topics like how the “War on Drugs” is a bunch of crap and the single biggest waste of taxpayer funds in the history of the nation solely due to its irrational lopsided focus on marijuana use by private citizens, and treating them worse than serial rapists and murderers) is when people skirt the topic of pedophilia and high school.

    In many US states, the legal age of consent is 16 years old. This is a non-conditional age limit, meaning that legally, a 50 year old man or woman may have legal, consensual sex with a 16 year old member of the opposite sex. (as if such a situation were to happen LOL)

    More specifically,:
    28 states define 16 as the legal age of consent.
    04 states define 17 as the legal age of consent.
    07 states define 18 as the legal age of consent.
    only 12 states have a “minimalist age difference clause” that define ages as low as 14 as the legal age of consent, as long as the involved partner is within a 2-3 year age difference. (Which is kind of the underlying message of this episode anyways i believe)

    My point is that from a strictly definition standpoint, a pedophile is someone OVER the age of 16 having sex with someone UNDER the age of 16.
    … … … (that is unless you live in the 44% of the nation that says 17 or 18 is the magic number… or maybe 14 or 15 as long as you aren’t older than 16, 17, or 18 )

    Having sex with a 16 year old is perfectly legal in 56% of the United States of America, however creepy you may think it is…

  28. 28 thisguy

    While the other two episodes I watched were hilarious and spot-on in terms of message and likely effectiveness, this one falls down into a shallow reiteration of the Great American Fear-Mongering and Hand-Wringing to do with teen sexuality. It’s been my conviction since my own teen years that teens are the most ripped-off age group in the population. Though treated like children, as they are legally defined to be till eighteen, they are often ready for adulthood far earlier, and I believe in many other countries and at many other times in history, they are and have been given at least the option of taking up the mantle of their adulthoods.

    We in this country commonly do little- certainly not enough- to prepare young people to assume their majority even at eighteen, and then use this unpreparedness as reason to keep defining teens as children. Instead of teaching them how to sensibly evaluate things, we just tell them to not do things they’re going to do anyway, so they do them in a state of ignorance. The message in this podcast does this. There will always be young people (of both sexes) that want to experiment with older people and simply telling them that they shouldn’t is not constructive. Calling the older party stupid or a loser is also not constructive, nor is it always true, although sometimes it undoubtedly is. But there is where the judgment of the teen should come into play, helped by the knowledge that she/he should have been given by parents, mentors, and society in general. Denied that teaching, the judgment is compromised, and the teen might much more easily be led up a rosy path they would otherwise eschew. Education is the best defense. Stern (and in this case poorly thought out, as the cancer reference demonstrates) admonitions to abstinence are a very ineffective defense.

    Basically, if a young person wants to have sex with someone older, whose business is it but theirs? A teen is not a child. Teens are beginning adults who tend to be experimentive and explorative, and while most don’t want to play with the age difference thing, some do. There are lots of creeps out there, there always have been and always will be, but they can’t be legislated or disapproved out of existence, so the best bulwark against them is to teach young people how to tell the difference between good intentions and bad. Same with all the other much worse, outright dangers in the hurly-burly of the world: knowledge improves judgment guards against danger. It’s simply incorrect to say that for this age group, this set of numbers is good and this other one is bad, because in the actual world that’s not how it works. For this podcast to kow-tow to this bugaboo undermines the rest of the series’ fine and needed message.

  29. 29 Ben English

    Based on the content, I assumed the episode was solely intended as humor. Then I read the comments. They seemed too well-considered to be simple replies to a goof of a vid, so I went back and read the “About” page for the site. The intent here is more serious than I realized, so factual errors are less deserving of a pass. In short, I am prompted to pedantry, distasteful as I find it.

    Humor is a matter of taste, but this episode was marred by two things.

    First was the cancer joke. Yes, the cancer joke was sufficiently mean (not funny, not informative, not thought-provoking, just shallow and mean) that it seriously undermined the message. How did it undermine the message? Because it prompted me to waste a paragraph talking about a cancer joke instead of teen sex.

    The second problem was a bit more involved; the script got the definition of “pedophile” wrong. By now, I’m sure everyone involved in the project has gotten around to looking it up, but for those who just came in: Pedophilia is sexual attraction to *pre-pubescent* partners aged 12 or younger. (Yes, I know that seems overly-specific, but academics tend to write such definitions.) Pedophilia is aberrant and should (IMO) be considered such, given that it fulfills no evolutionary function; it doesn’t propagate the species.

    Attraction to post-pubescent partners is, well, normal. In a “survival of the species” sense, as soon as someone has passed puberty, they’re fair game for sexual union, inasmuch as such a union can result in pregnancy and help the species survive.

    For social reasons, we set an age somewhat above that of puberty to legally sanction sexual unions. That age may be as low as 16 in the U.S., since Hawaii changed their laws a few years ago, raising their age of consent from 14. If you’ve ever sat on a jury hearing a case of aggravated sexual assault of a child, you can understand that those social reasons are darn complex. In fact, one Supreme Court justice is on record as saying that the age of consent should be 12, everywhere. From a practical and legal perspective, that viewpoint is elegantly reasonable; it would mean no more Genarlow Wilson cases and still wouldn’t hinder the prosecution of real rapists. (Politically, of course, it’s a non-starter.)

    As an aside, an exclusive sexual attraction to post-pubescent partners under the age of consent is known as hebephilia. And then there’s ephebophilia, attraction to partners at approximately puberty. And then there’s defining a particular kink as optional or exclusive. And then there’s paraphilia (as a catch-all) and infantophilia and pederasty and phebophilia and…well, once scientists start classifying things, they never seem to have enough ever-more-precise categories, do they? Read through the definitions used by the American Psychiatric Association and contained in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders and you eventually find yourself asking: “Was this trip really necessary?” (Holy Cow, I just dated myself :-)

    Someone attracted to partners below the age of consent but past puberty may be a creep, a criminal, living in his mommas basement, or worse. But in psychological terms, he can’t be classed as aberrant. Throwing around the label “pedophile” when you’re talking about people who aren’t pedophiles is, at minimum, confusing. Now, age differences are fertile ground for comedy and social commentary. They are a wonderful way to get people talking. Please hit the theme another time; this effort showed great promise. But gross factual errors (that are not obviously being used as a joke) *really* screw up the conversation. I suggest you work harder to avoid them.

  30. 30 Duane DeTaub

    waaaaaaahhhhhhh waaaaahhhhhhh call a wahhhmbulance because we got a bunch of big babies that can’t take a cancer joke. As the chairperson for the Ankle Cancer Survivors Group of Greater Saskatchawan, I can speak with authority when I say that the only cure for cancer will come from belittling it with sarcasm. I have personally witnessed cancer being removed from a patient simply thru prolonged condescension. This was discovered when my uncle’s sisterwife was watching Brain Candy (Kids in the Hall), specifically the scene with Cancer Boy, and she laughed so hard that it scared the uvula cancer right out of her. Nikol is simply doing her part in the race for the cure and you small-minded midwaste-eners should sit back and enjoy a tall, frosty glass of shut the f*ck up. I censored that last line myself so you wouldn’t have a second topic to cry about. Because I care.

  31. 31 George

    Is this a joke?

    Let me translate “Girls mature early” to you:
    They (usually) *physically* mature earlier. Their brains are typically full of shi* at the same percentage as everyone else at that age bracket. (ie., most) (Even more so, because they are spoon fed with out of reality expectations from romance films.)

    “Older guys just want sex”. No shi*, Sherlock. Do you mean that the guys at a younger age (the same as the girls’ you are talking about) aren’t interested in just sex? You are so full of it. On the other hand, an older guy actually can have the experience, maturity and education to actually care and be able to help a younger person. (This holds both for girls and boys.) There are loosers at every age bracket. You should learn how to find and avoid them, and not just avoid someone because he is some years older.

    Anyways, this video is so stupid, that it may be a joke, but a really bad one.

  32. 32 michael

    The people who are taking this so seriously are ALMOST as funny as the show itself. Keep it up guys! All of you!

  33. 33 Eleri

    I’m glad that people are taking this videos seriously, and not as some generic found-it-on-teh-internets joke, because these are *exactly* the sorts of videos our teens should be seeing in health class.

    That said, I do think this one was a bit off, and I think now that the great team making them knows where the glitches in content are, they can, hopefully, rework it into something really powerful.

    Age of consent is a wonky thing… as I pointed out to my 17 year old son, after his birthday next year, his relationship with his girlfriend of 2 years will be illegal if they are having sex.

    So the issue isn’t so much with that *age* of the people involved, but with the dynamic & maturity of the relationship.

  34. 34 Anony

    I think the video was funny. The joke about cancer missed the mark, but it was funny overall. I can’t believe the people on here defending men for dating/wanting to date high school girls. Let’s be real, most people date and marry in their own age range for a reason. And it’s a crock of bull to pretend that men aren’t attracted to women over 24. I don’t think many would be turning down Halle Berry or Catherine Zeta Jones. I still firmly believe that most men who solely/mainly date much younger women do so because they want control, want someone who is easily impressed, and will not catch on to the man’s immaturity as fast as as someone his own age would. I’ve known a guy like that for years who is now mid-30’s and still dating 18-22 yr olds. It never lasts long because he is STILL a commitment-phobe and a toxic bachelor. His justifications for dating that age range are so pathetic. I’d warn younger girls to watch out for men older men because if they were really so mature and caring, they could handle being in a relationship with someone their own age.

  35. 35 meresoul

    I started seeing a (married) 26 year old shortly after I turned 16. She had 3 kids, we had a 4th. Eventually this ended in a divorce. I’m 30 now, and have had a lot of time to reflect on this. I’m glad people are trying to educate young people on the topic, but an angle that isn’t mentioned is the way that guilt and responsibility play a part in pressuring people into relationships like this. I see now that her seeking me out (subconsciously) was a search for way to escape a failed marriage. I played the role of a crutch, with a large libido. I hope other young men can be warned of situations like this just as much as young women.

    P.S. The sex was amazing. Tantalizing bait. ;)

  36. 36 Larry

    I have an idea. Let’s incorporate everyone’s concerns and criticisms into making a Sex Ed video for teens. Make sure every reference is properly supported by solid psychiatric science (as if that exists) and then make a video aimed at teenagers. Let’s also make sure no one is offended. Then, by golly, you’ll have a video that I guarantee teens WILL NOT watch.

    Now is everyone happy!

  37. 37 Shannon

    Cancer comment? HYS-terical. And my father died after a long drawn out battle with cancer, etc. etc. And still the cancer bit was FUNNY!

  38. 38 Ken

    I like parody, and giving people wrong advice is hilarious. Also, I feel that giving real advice is important. Also, making something teens would laugh at is important. But this just doesn’t gel…somehow, it got just the right amount of DURRRRRR in it. Wow.

  39. 39 Bill

    My ex is getting married to a 45 year old (her high school math teacher)… And she’s 18… Dear South Africa…

  40. 40 Holly

    Oh my god this is great!!! I really would love to work with you!!

    -me (holly)

  41. 41 Alive and Kicking

    Your show is GREAT — funny, sex positive, and mostly accurate, although there are some small information gaps. However, you might think about editing this episode, specifically the segment with the cancer “joke” — a poorly chosen analogy comparing cancer to pedophilia in terms of illness:”If you’re in junior high and you’re dating someone who’s out of high school he’s a pedophile, and pedophilia is a disease. Would you date someone with cancer? NO!Not that cancer is exempt from gallows humor but it was not appropriate here, a sign of ignorance and truly ill-advised. People with cancer do, in fact, date. It’s not contagious.And seriously, if you were a teenager in love with another teenager who was diagnosed with cancer, would you run for the hills? I suppose it depends on how much you care for them. Staying with the person or leaving them — either can happen in such sad circumstances.Signed, person who had cancer.

  42. 42 Marc

    Technically, I am one year older than my girlfriend, but it looks like more because she is swedish, and swedes start school later.
    We go to thesame school ( or atleast, went untill a couple of months ago) and she is 2 years below me. My 18th birthday is coming up in 4 days, and the funny thing is, once it happens, my gf is 16 and i am 18. According to the law, I can’t have sex with her untill her birthday, the 18th of december. So my birthday is either the day I become a pedofile, or the day I stop having sex for months.
    happy birthday to me …

  43. 43 fredhag

    It looks like I have not heard of these videos until much after the main discussion regarding this one, but I agree with J Storm and RJ. It was very poor form regarding the cancer bit. I don’t think the clause about cancer was humor, and I think it was more than a faux pas as someone put it. Regardless the number of commenters that would or would not date someone with cancer, it was inhumane to cast cancer patients as not worthy of dating.

  44. 44 Nabil

    Marc: you’re not a pedophile in that circumstance, you’re just facing statutory charges if you decide to have sex with her during that period.

    Having gone through the videos before and after, this is definitely the weak one. I appreciate that you’re primarily aiming at the female teen demographic, but this one didn’t just exclude the male segment, it vilified them, without remotely addressing the same behavior with reversed genders. One in particular comes to mind where his girlfriend (who took his virginity) had a daughter his age. These scenarios aren’t rare, but they’re rarely brought up.

    As has already been already brought up repeatedly in the comments (not to beat a dead horse, but people still seem to be missing it), being in your 20s or 30s or even older and being attracted to a 16 year old does not make you a pedophile. Pedophilia is attraction to pre-pubescent people. Depending on the gap, it might make you creepy, but NOT a pedophile, damnit! Stop tossing such a charged word around, it just comes off as fear mongering, and counter to the whole point behind the show.

    What I would have really preferred to see out of a segment on this topic:
    1) ways to spot “players” (it would benefit handling approaches from creeps no matter the age… older people simply have had more time to practice, the behavior is the same)
    2) some quick rules of thumb for age gaps, such as the “high school rule” (if you would have been in high school at the same time, then it’s fair game… that gives you a 7 year spread for a dating pool, your year and 3 on either side… if you can’t find someone in that range, maybe you’re not really ready to date).
    3) encouragement to stick to your guns: keep control on the pace of the relationship, and don’t let your partner rush you into something you’re not ready for.

    I’m enjoying the videos in general (keep it up!), but this video just really rankled, and I think does more harm than good.

  45. 45 Ivy

    Would you date someone with cancer? NO! LOL! That was mean, but funny. I love you Nikol. You are silly.

  46. 46 ph

    what’s so terrible about dating someone with cancer? that seemed a little cruel.

  47. 47 Todd

    Britney is just too much with the characters. I love you both. This is a very entertaining and yet educational. Keep up the good work.

  48. 48 Kelev

    I’m a gay male who had my first real relationship with another guy when I was between the ages of 12 and 13. He was 20-21 y.o. at the time. I was not “molested”, “abused” or forced into anything. If anything, *I* was the one who initiated things. Despite the age difference (maybe even *because* of the age difference) the relationship was safe, mutual, consensual and fun!

    I’ve talked to a lot of other gay/bi-/queer guys of all ages who’ve had similar experiences with older guys. When you “come out” as a gay kid, the realization you’re gay usually comes with the realization that most of the people you know aren’t gay. Even now, with more gay kids coming out, it can be pretty lonely.

    Gay teens who are trying to do all the things our straight friends are doing like date, fall in love, and yes, get physical, often find the chance with older partners. Again, this is pretty common and often (mostly?) isn’t a problem. For a gay kid coming out in a straight world, having an older partner can also provide support and guidance that might help deal with the pain, frustration and lonliness that often comes with coming out.

    In my case, my first relationship probably saved my life.

    I know it’s probably different for gays than for straights. It’s different for girls than for boys (younger girls with older guys / younger guys with older women etc.) Every individual relationship is different from every other, really.

    Yes, we should keep our eyes open for abuse when there’s an age difference. But we should keep our eys open anyway. Always. Age difference or no. And if there’s no abuse, if everyone involved in the relationship is happy with it and being safe and healthy, we shouldn’t be bigots about it just because there’s an age difference.

    Homosexuality used to be considered a “crime” and a “disease”. Then people (at least some people) woke up and saw it’s just another way of being. My first boyfriend could have gotten into a lot of trouble because of our relationship. He might have been labeled a “pervert” or a “criminal”. I wonder how many people who have been caught and labeled like that don’t deserve it.

    Again, as long as the people who are actually *in* the relationship are happy with it, I think society, parents, doctors, police, lawyers etc. should butt out. Yes, they can all have their opinions. Freedom of speech, and all that. But otherwise people should be free to love and live with whoever they want so long as they’re not being forced and hurt.

  49. 49 cG

    It grew hard and it grew fast with those children of Indiana in those nights of Indiana but she is only one girl of small town, living in a desert world. So it took the train from midnight that went to any place. Now it is working in the man every night and day. But never it lost a minute of worrisome dream on how they could have been things. Because she is beautiful not to matter what you say. Words cannot make fall it. ..Es like the wind is beautiful in each way….

  50. 50 Trent

    And would you date someone with cancer? No.


  51. 51 David G

    I think the point was made in an earlier comment, but men who feel attraction for post-pubescent teen girls are technically ephebophiles. But, culturally I think you have the situation pegged pretty accurately. I am enjoying your podcasts. Keep up the good work.

  52. 52 Andrea

    Hey, heard about your website from the morning show. This video is so wrong. I am with a guy who is 28 and i am 17. Everything is great with us. HE IS NOT A LOSER. We have been married for like a year now. I didnt want to date anyone from high-school cause they are losers. dating someone older is only good if you know what are the older guys intentions. I love him so much…age is just a number. as long as you get along and love each other its ok.

  53. 53 maria

    The cancer part was stupid but the rest was on the spot. I found out that my 40 year old husband was dating a girl who just turned 18. She called me to inform me on her birthday. He has a 15 year old teenager son from a previous marriage and an eleven son with me. I am 40 years old and have a Bachelor’s degree and support myself . Thank god. I was horrified. Yes, he is a pedophile in my eyes. He owes child support and was arrested several times in the past four years for domestic violence with this person. Teenagers should think twice before involving themselves with these losers. I put up with a lot while I was with him. This was definitely the final straw.

  54. 54 maria

    The cancer part was stupid but the rest was on the spot. I found out that my 40 year old husband was dating a girl who just turned 18. She called me to inform me on her birthday. He has a 15 year old teenager (son) from a previous marriage and an eleven son (with me). I am 40 years old and have a Bachelor’s degree and am able to support myself . Thank god. I was horrified when I found out. Yes, he is a pedophile in my eyes. He owes child support and was arrested several times in the past four years for domestic violence with this person. Teenagers should think twice before involving themselves with these losers. I put up with a lot while I was with him. This was definitely the final straw.

  55. 55 Canadian

    Adult male humans are bio-anthropologically designed to be engaging in sex with females who have reached puberty. As a matter of fact, the age of consent in Canada is 14 years old. You are preaching the old pedophile hysteria crap that is growing tiresome in the puritanical social climate here in the US. Preach some truth, would ya.

  56. 56 Bella

    OMG I LOVE YOU!! this is so funny!

  57. 57 Dag

    1) Pedophilia is not a decease
    2) Interest in teenagers is not pedophilia, it is hebephilia or ephebophilia at most
    3) This episode is built on 100% prejudice and 0% facts

  58. 58 Shirley

    You guys missed the mark with this one because you were judging, criticizing and inflicting your own beliefs. I thought the point of the midwestteensexshow was to have teens make educated decisions not judge them for the decisions they do make. If I had not been to this site before and saw this video first I would have thought this was some conservative right wing abstinence only propaganda aimed at teen girls (cause there is no mention of teen boys dating older women) to stay pure for marriage. I don’t think you guys really thought this one out especially the caner joke, warts funny, cancer not. I hope you guys come better next time because this one missed the boat.

  59. 59 Autymn D. C.

    Do ye edit or read EncyclopædiaDramatica by any hap? Ageism in friends and laws is the disease…

    -encyclopedophile (egcucliòpaideiòfilè)
    (Hey, look, my captcha is “21.” and “reflected”.. which anminds me of the site Inquisition21.)

  60. 60 Kyle


    I am stunned! Nikol, you need to start educating yourself, BEFORE you make these videos.

    First, pedophillia is not a disease, it is a mental condition.

    Secondly, pedophilia is NOT sexually biased. Females also suffer from pedophilia. If you are going to make an attempt to guide out youth, sterotyping is not the way to do it.

    Where did you get the “Fact” that if you are dating a person out of high school, and you are in highschool, that person is a pedophile? That is the furthest from the truth. I dated my wife for 8 years, we met in highschool, she was a year behind me. SO once I graduated, I became a pedohile? Hmmmm, let me think about that one.

    Lastly, I have skin cancer, and my wife still loves me, and I still love her. I resent the fact that you have made light of such a serious ailment.

    If a person would not date a person with cancer, just because of that, even though they are attrated to each other, that is commonly refered to as shallow. Those people should not be dating anyway, as thier DNA needs to stay out of the gene pool/

    I hope you will start researching what you are placing in the public forums, and especially what you are telling our young adults. They deserve to have all of the ACURATE facts.



  61. 61 SawtheTVreport

    I don’t agree with the ugly attitude of this video or this ugly website. An ugly attitude only begets ugly people.

    I think the people involved in this venture are unwise, or rather, not careful in what they are doing.

    I don’t think the videos are funny or entertaining, nor do I find the people particularly talented, nor would I guess they are intelligent and knowledgeble about much else in life let alone qualified for giving good advice.

    I think it’s a cheap attention-getting ploy to have the girl both in the bikini top and gesturing as to rub her body at the start of the video, it’s sensationalism and therefore inappropriate or even hypocritical regarding the topic.

    My only question is: Is this site a family enterprise? Because that would explain the ugly resemblance you all have to each other. It also looks to me like the bikini-topped girl and the older, thick-jawed lady (who looks like an angry lesbian) look like mother and daughter.

    It is one thing for a family to have healthy or “open” discussions of sexuality with respect to a time and a place for everything, but this website demonstrates an entirely different thing–besides demonstrating a lack of intuitional reason–it demonstrates a family which appears to be obsessed with talking about sex in all ways and at all times (indiscriminately). That’s just wrong!

  62. 62 Sex Offender Evaluator

    I viewed this site partly because I am considering using it in class discussions on one of my classes. I also am a forensic evaluator and have evaluated sexual offenders for court sentencing purposes. The issue of definitions of pedophilia, etc. have been already dealt with, although I understand that the other terms are not widely know to the public and the use of the term “pedophile”, while not technically accurate, may be useful in the video in getting teens to think about the meaning of the age difference between them.

    The issue that has received much less attention is that the data is very clear about sexual offenders (whether pedophile, rapist, whatever)– they are a type of criminal. Whether or not the video got the technical term right, if an older adult (male or female) is having any kind of sexual relationship with a person below the age of consent, they are committing a crime. Whether you believe the law and the age specified are valid or not is irrelevant. The question is, knowing the law, WHY would an older adult deliberately and knowingly violate the law? Especially because they can easily obtain sexual relationships with adults their own age.

    I accept that there may be some exceptions such as people who are close in age who have a long-term relationship where one becomes a legal adult, etc., but in the VAST majority of cases, the “older boyfriend” is engaging in criminal behavior and doing so knowingly. Sex offenders frequently commit many other kinds of crimes in addition to the sexual offenses, so their sexual offenses are just another manifestation of a tendency toward antisocial behavior. This is partly why most states have adopted the issue of sex offender registration — to let neighbors know that a sexual offender has moved into their neighborhood so they are forewarned.

    The real problem is that vast majority of younger people that become caught up in these relationships (even those who believe that *they* approached the older person) do NOT have the same level of cognitive development or emotional development as an adult. They are more vulnerable, they are more likely to not understand the emotional or physical/medical consequences of either their own or their “lover’s” behavior, etc. The adult, presumably and legally, IS more mature, more cognitively developed (unless they are brain damaged), and ARE aware of these issues. No matter what the younger person believes or says, with extremely unusual exceptions, they are being taken advantage of, being exploited. This is more and more true the younger the person is when the relationship begins. Sex offenders deliberately look for victims in a specfic “target” age range and often “groom” them by establishing friendships or a trusting relationship first. In the case of pedophiles, they are offenders who have even married a woman in order to gain access to sexually exploit her children or “grow his own” victims. If the video does nothing more than get them to take a second look at their situation, it is doing a service. (Although I would encourage Nikol to edit the sequence to change the cancer reference).

  63. 63 mh

    Since when is Pedofilia a disorder. It is a blatant disregard of the laws God has given. This whole website is ubsurd. I do agree kids should learn about sex from their parents. They should also learn that sex is for marriage - not entertainment.

  64. 64 Kelev

    Hey “Sex Offender Evaluator”, do you have a t-shirt that has that emblazoned on it? Maybe MTSS should make one! Careful if you tuck it in too far, though. People might only be able to see the “Sex Offender” half, and then you’d have to explain.

    “Uh, sir…about your shirt…?”

    “What? Oh, that! No, wait, you don’t understand. I can explain. Let me just pull this part out…” (begins to undo belt)

    “Hey! None of that you sick perv! I’m gonna kick yer ass!”


    Seriously though, I see where you’re coming from. The only thing I would say in response, in addition to what I wrote of my story a few posts above, is that there are other realities to the ones you see, and to the situations you evaluate.

    I would never want to do your job. I’m sure you see things that make you question your faith in humanity (assuming you have any…I know I have very little). But what you probably never see are situations like mine that are perhaps almost as common, if not more so.

    And further, I wonder if, even in the event you did come across a scenario like mine, if you’d see it for what it is or simply assume it’s abusive because that’s all you’re used to seeing.

    Ultimately, I think we need to be far more critical and nuanced in our approach to these matters. The simple fact is that the mere existence of age difference is not enough to call something abusive, nor should it be enough to criminalise something.

    I mean, not long ago, gays, race mixers and masturbators were the “sex offenders” who broke laws exactly like the ones you take for granted today. And all that stuff about “cognitive development” was exactly the same argument used to “prove” that “weak (white) women” were being seduced by Black men. Why else would a white woman stoop to such a level? went the racist, sexist argument. To do such a thing in the first place was prima facie evidence of a woman’s cognitive deficiency, and of the Black man’s innate, predatory nature.

    (and just as scary is some people still believe that garbage!)

    Why would an adult enter into a relationship with a minor? Why would a Black man date a white woman, or vice versa? Why would a woman date another woman? You see how odd your question is, in a certain light? It assumes sex is wrong. Why *wouldn’t* we? one should ask.

    People do all those things (and more!) because that’s what people do. And at some point in time, in some part of the globe, even in plenty of places today, just about any and every kind of sexual preference, predilection or kink has been demonised and banned, while somewhere else those same practises are considered completely normal.

    As a parent and a self-defense instructor, I’m the first person to say we need to be smart and informed about the actual dangers of real sex offenders in our midst. On that I think we can all agree. But as a Queer, a professional researcher in the field of sociology, and ultimately as a critical thinker, I also think we need to be wary of the very real dangers posed by “Sex Offender Evaluators”, with all due respect.

    Check out Judith Levine’s book, “Harmful to Minors: The perils of protecting kids from sex”. And if you google or wiki research by Rind, Tromovitch & Bauserman, you’ll see some thought provoking studies, as well as the discussions their research has spawned. Here’s some:


  65. 65 Navitas

    Ok, to all those on the cancer comment. I know that you are all having your opinions about it, well here’s mine on what I’ve read thus far. Cancer doesn’t discriminate against age, gender or beliefs. Would a teenager date someone with cancer? Why the hell not? Teenagers aren’t immune to cancer. So the question really is, would a teenager old date another teenager? Again, Why the hell not?

    So, it looks like they dropped the ball on this episode. Whoops. ‘poop’ happens. I’m glad that the main message of all the pod casts as a whole aren’t missed. (12 thus far)

    Ok, that’s my rant. Carry on.


  66. 66 kara in indy

    …omg…like omfg…I was going to say this was a really cool site till I saw this video… it pissed me off so bad!!!….lol …so my boyfreind (hes 19) is a pedophile cuz hes dating me cuz Im 16 ????!!?…
    this is so ridiculus retarded…besides the fact that I known him forever. I am guessing you made this for girls my age? I suppose I am supposed to date someone like 15 or 16 ? My boyfreind is like the most nicest mature guy I know even more so than some men I know twice his age. He has a really good job, and is buying a place, and we’re gonna move in together eventually…thank you for calling our relationship a disease…lol…like now I know why some girls get pregnant…siriously you sound like a bunch of older women trying to get back yer teen years or sumthin cuz you missed out, and I have noticed older women flirt with by bf before…lol…so instead of calling peoples relationships “diseases” why don’t u jealous older loser women just get a life and deal with people yer own age and stop obsessing with teenagers…arrrgggghhh…

  67. 67 Kimberly

    One comment–that Paul Okami guy comes off as a complete a–hole. He categorizes women that have “less power” as those who are unattractive, have lower social status, and are ASYMETRICAL?!? Powerful women come in all different shapes, sizes, social classes, etc. Power does not lie within physical beauty! There are so many powerful women in our society today that do not conform to society’s standards of beauty.

    Get with it, Paul!
    Quit perpetuating the great gender divide.
    And, please, for everyone’s sake, stop being a douche!


  68. 68 Kimberly

    I agree with one of those posts above. A more effective choice would be, “Would you date someone with an STD? No!” No one wants an STD, but people can’t help getting cancer. Too touchy a subject. Too soon. Give it at least until they find a cure!


  69. 69 Kelev


    I’m no expert on Okami’s writings, but I am pretty familiar with his over-all message.

    I’m sure that he’s not saying that this is the way things *should* be, but that it is often the way things are in practise. It’s the difference between being “descriptive” and “prescriptive”, like when sociologists link race and poverty, for example. We’re not saying that black Americans should earn less than white Americans, we’re just reporting the (sad) fact that these objective physical traits have very real consequences where things like power, income, self-esteem etc are concerned.

    Indeed, you could even say that Okami is actually helping to dispell these dangerous prejudices by calling them out explicitly; “Know thy enemy” as the saying goes.

  70. 70 Brian

    It’s NOT about the joking with cancer, it’s about the equating cancer with pedophiles, that is wrong.
    Cancer patients tell and hear a lot of cancer jokes, so not the point.

    ““Older guys just want sex”. No shi*, Sherlock. Do you mean that the guys at a younger age (the same as the girls’ you are talking about) aren’t interested in just sex?”

    Sorry, I laughed out LOUD at that one. Was that okay?

    In order for your then 18 year old son to have illegal sex with his gf, she must be 12 or 13 NOW. I mean, EEEWW! In lotsa states, 18-14 or 17-13 is allowed, if theres 3, 4 or 5 years between them. (to play safe: no ‘foreign objects’ or anal/oral sex). All this of course depending on the state you’re in, which is it? if you can read legalese …
    The bottom is 11 years old, I think, but 12 y.o. can have sex with 13 y.o.’s and so on. 10-12 is a no-no.

    There seems to be a widespread believe that as soon as boys become 18 or leave high school they can’t date or sex their GF’s no more.
    This, IS NOT TRUE, according to the law.
    In short, the legislator seems to have thought that outlawing teen sex or teen dating was a bad idea.

  71. 71 Hank

    Would it be mean to suggest that older women attack older men - younger women relationships because of jealousy?
    I guess, most reasonably attractive women have no problem whatsoever attracting male attention until they’re 25. After that age, “getting the eye” is not an automatic anymore.

    What was weird about this episode was that older men - younger women relationships is the norm in ALL human societies, have you checked to see how much CRAP Ashton Kucher and Demi Moore are getting?
    Some very succesful relations with big age-gaps have existed. This is usually a very smart or talented girl. Google Judit Polgar.
    Now, I’m not saying that all of the male chess world had dirty thoughts, but when this very pretty girl, at age 9, or 10 started beating Grand Master of chess, I can savely say pretty much all the males had some sort of infatuation going on with her.
    She is the youngest, prettiest and smartest of the 3 Polgar sisters and she has beaten every single male on the planet. Now, the big attraction surely wasn’t her looks, but her surely her brains.
    My point is that precocious kids have a tendency to fancy older partners, this is not unnatural, it’s a variation. Most 15 year old girls are really bored with 15 y.o boys, dating anyone under 15 is quite exceptional.

    Biological theory even claims that the 16 y.o. girl is the most attractive to men, since at that age she’s gives men the strongest fertility signal. (Yes, this might be a conspiracy of male biologists to get some highschool a s s), but nonetheless, being attracted to a 16 year old girl is not strange. It might not be sensible, but neither is creaming your pants for Leo diCaprio, so ….

    I would make the point that EVERY male is a theoretical pedophile, since we all lust after 16 year olds, but of course most us don’t act on it. Bu most of us wouldn’t mind having our spouses look 16 all through life. Neither would women, in reverse, I imagine.

  72. 72 Nimby

    Since when is Pedofilia a disorder. It is a blatant disregard of the laws God has given. This whole website is ubsurd. I do agree kids should learn about sex from their parents. They should also learn that sex is for marriage - not entertainment.

    You know, we’ll take you a lot more seriously if you learn to spell correctly.

    But anyway… sex is *fun*, making it, I don’t know, *for entertainment*. Sorry your sex life inside your marriage is boring, but hey, at least that’s the way it’s supposed to be, right… right?

  73. 73 Nimby

    “…omg…like omfg…I was going to say this was a really cool site till I saw this video… it pissed me off so bad!!!….lol …so my boyfreind (hes 19) is a pedophile cuz hes dating me cuz Im 16 ????!!?…
    this is so ridiculus retarded…besides the fact that I known him forever. I am guessing you made this for girls my age? I suppose I am supposed to date someone like 15 or 16 ? My boyfreind is like the most nicest mature guy I know even more so than some men I know twice his age.”
    “…siriously you sound like a bunch of older women trying to get back yer teen years or sumthin cuz you missed out, and I have noticed older women flirt with by bf before…lol…so instead of calling peoples relationships “diseases” why don’t u jealous older loser women just get a life and deal with people yer own age and stop obsessing with teenagers…arrrgggghhh…

    They’re trying to help you, you ungrateful brat. And yes… 19 to 16 is pushing it (and I think, personally, you’re actually “almost 16″, but my intuition could be on the fritz). And I hate to tell you this, but YOU SOUND JUST LIKE EVERY CLUELESS GIRL WHO HAS LET AN OLDER GUY TAKE ADVANTAGE OF HER AND THEN LEAVE HER BY THE WAYSIDE.

    And another thing. Nikol, if I remember correctly, got pregnant after a one-night stand. So she’s not trying to “make up” for anything. It sounded like she’s had a few unfortunate experiences, and her bio even (albeit jokingly) refers to her as a former practitioner of teen promiscuity. So wow, you managed to get your facts wrong AND look like a totally insensitve bitch! That takes talent.

    Some of us support you, Nikol!

  74. 74 Nimby

    I don’t think the videos are funny or entertaining, nor do I find the people particularly talented, nor would I guess they are intelligent and knowledgeble about much else in life let alone qualified for giving good advice.

    I think it’s a cheap attention-getting ploy to have the girl both in the bikini top and gesturing as to rub her body at the start of the video, it’s sensation

    Okay, glad you expressed your opinion! YOU ARE FREE TO LEAVE WITHOUT BEING MORE INSULTING, JACKASS!

  75. 75 Tim

    I think this episode was a pretty good one but I think it could have went without the cancer comment…
    Apparently you don’t have anyone in your family who has/had cancer, so it can be a huge joke for you.
    As someone who has lost quite a few people in my family to cancer, and as someone who is at a high risk of cancer, I think this comment was flat out disrespectful.

    Other than that good episode and nice website.

  76. 76 mom and dad for responsible sex ed

    if we expect our kids to “get it right” then we think that those of us promoting responsible sex ed need to do just that.

    Issues related to teen sexuality including


    not to mention……

    are truly serious and pervasive issues. Mostly….they’re not very funny.

    If this podcast uses humor to convey a healthy message to teens we truly support that.

    But when the humor crosses the line to disseminate misinformation and skew the facts then truly this podcast is no more valuable nor effective than the abstinence only programs which claim to educate and empower our teens.

    We truly hope you pull this video. It is being watched by perhaps thousands. It is mis educating at least some kids who don’t get the humor. And while you can’t please all the people all the time we are certain you can do a better job with this one. We would expect no less from our own kids.

    If your core intention behind this effort is simply humor….then leave the video….(even though the humor was lost on many of us)

    If your core intention behind this video is to help educate and de-stigmatize this oh-so-loaded topic of teen/human sexuality…then maybe it would help to make a new video…sort of admit that you messed up and fix it. That would be responsible….you know “responsiblity” …that thing you guys want teens to embrace?

    But while you are deciding what to do….the teens are watching.

  77. 77 Big Kev

    This is something that I wish was around when I was a teen. I grew up with so many females that thought sleeping with old men and getting pregnant was better than winning the noble peace prize. N.J. keep up the good work and lets break the cycle. Some people are not taking this seriously or seem to be angry with the way this episode was done, but I feel this episode gets right to the point. A real life example of the type of problems a situation like this can bring is the Stacy Peterson case that is currently in the news. She was abused and under-aged when she was approached by Drew Peterson who was in his 40’s at the time he met her, not even mentioning Drew Peterson was a cop and knew he was breaking the law by taking indecent liberties with a minor. She was technically a child in the eyes of the law. Now look at that situation, and ask yourselves “Could I end up like this?” It’s a dangerous game indeed. Young ladies don’t let yourselves become the next Stacy Peterson.

    An additional word of advice to the youth. Many good productive single adults tend to not want to date a person with out-of-wedlock kids, turbulent lives, or emotional baggage later in life. It makes us feel that you are damaged goods and not worth the effort. Avoid the creeps, morons, players, and pedophiles. You will thank yourself later in life when you are grown and mature enough to reap the benefits. But for now enjoy the benefits of being young and being a kid. Don’t be in such a rush to grow up so fast. I’ve watched so many of my friends, male and female, fall into that trap, and I listen to their lamentations all the time. It just ain’t worth it.

  78. 78 BACHE

    The responsibility for these relationships rests solely with the “older boyfriend”..not with the teens who are manipulated, coerced and seduced.

    From beginning to end the video places the responsibility squarely on the shoulders of the teen victim;

    “ask the guy such and such” “don’t do this” “don’t do that”

    As a society we continually fall into this trap that blames the girl/woman for what happens to her as the result of a man’s actions against her. We create videos like this one that tells kids to assume the role of the adult. No! adults are the responsible parties here..not the teen.

    Outside of the irresponsible cancer comment the greater issue as I see it has to do with how we approach the very real and very difficult problem of sexual abuse. Which by and large happens to girls/women at the hands of men.

    This video, in spite of what some young women may think, does nothing to empower them.

    If you are interested in reading a better and more responsible article on this subject (and others) go to:

  79. 79 Kelev


    You say, “The responsibility for these relationships rests solely with the “older boyfriend”..not with the teens who are manipulated, coerced and seduced.”

    As someone who has taught women’s self defense, I agree that we shouldn’t “blame the victim”. Yes, that happens too often.

    But we also need to acknowledge that the responsibility for any relationship, good or bad, rests to some degree with both (all) parties. Of course exceptions exist. But in general, those who may be exploited (which is anyone, really) need to be equipped and be aware of the skills and habits necessary for surviving in a world where, sorry, but not everyone you encounter has your best interests at heart, Little Red Riding Hood.

    You can place all the “responsibility” you want on the Big Bad Wolf. I’m sure he’d like that. And misuse that. That’s what real predators do (and just as an aside, that story is a gross misrepresentation of wolves…I’m just citing it for rhetorical purposes).

    Don’t depend on any heroic woodcutters to come in and save the day either, deus ex machina. Might work in fairy tales, not real life.

    And of course, we’re talking about rape, here. But what about when things are much more subtle, less black and white, open to interpretation?

    The simple fact is that everyone in a relationship (every relationship, really, not just intimate sexual ones - this applies to work, school, family, etc.) needs to be able to be clear about what they want out of that relationship, to be able to articulate that, to listen to others about their needs, and to draw lines when needs are not being met.

    These skills actually aren’t that advanced. Pre-schoolers are capable of much of this, until school punishes kids for speaking their minds, labeling them as “trouble” for speaking up and saying “No!”. We (parents, teachers, peers) should encourage children and young people to be assertive and to take responsibility when those around them don’t do so or do it wrong.

    We should encourage kids to be assertive in all areas of life (home, school, work, relationships, and so on). No special privileges for teachers or bosses to coerce, humiliate, or pressure. Is it any wonder when young people get into dysfunctional, abusive relationships after years of being abused at and by school? School is one big abuse factory.

    We should reward kids for gravitating towards people and things that make them feel good, and support their intuition when they avoid those things and people that make them feel bad.

    This isn’t “blaming the victim”. These are life skills. Just like helmets and seat belts, everyone should have them and use them ’cause you never know who’ll run into you out there.

  80. 80 BACHE

    Hi Kelev,

    I truly appreciate your feedback and if I missed the mark here, my apologies. I agree with your perspective that we should do all we can to teach assertiveness skills to all young people. Certainly when young men are not taught healthy, assertive and respectful interpersonal skills they risk falling into unhealthy relationships…and possibly go down the road to becoming an abuser themselves. Whether it is self defense or simply clear communication and setting personal boundaries you are correct…it is very important.

    What troubles me deeply is what I see as an imbalance in how the issue of sexual abuse/assault gets addressed. Very little is done to hold the adult perpetrator (usually male) accountable while on the other hand there is a flood of information for what girls should or should not do in order to stay safe.

    I think it’s high time we go after the abusers and stop holding the abused responsible. As a person who was “nicely molested” by more than one older male, date raped and viciously attacked, twice, I know that there was nothing I could have done. The molestations were secret…and I KNEW about saying “no”. But being so young, 11, 12, 13, I was easily coerced and manipulated. So far as the attacks…one happened in broad daylight on a very busy street…not in some back alley or a dark parking lot. And yes I fought like hell but that didn’t stop the attack.

    I realize the video is only attempting to address “older boyfriends” but the message is clearly saying that these guys are molesters/sexual abusers. I agree. And therefore the responsibility and accountability for the abuse absolutely rests solely on the shoulders of the abuser. Young girls do not ask to be molested or coerced into unhealthy sexual relationships.

    Of course if we are talking about two consenting people of similar age where things go bad then yes ,I agree with you. Both parties share equal responsibility. But sexual abuse/assault is a whole different beast.

    As a mother of two sons I have always felt that it was my responsibility to disallow my boys to turn a blind eye to sexual abuse and the insidious ways in which abusive male sexual behavior is allowed, even encouraged and cultivated in society. Men are by and large the problem. Young girls and what they do or don’t do is not.

    I do think there is amazing talent here with these podcasts and I can certainly get behind the effort of providing quality sexuality education to our youth including teaching them how to identify and avoid potential sexual abusers. But again…there is already an abundance of that information out there. I would really like to see us shift our focus to the heart of the issue which is the abuser himself.

    Thank you for hearing me out on this and for engaging in what I think is an important discussion.

  81. 81 BACHE

    I am checkin out of this discussion not because I don’t think the topic isn’t important but because I think this site is a humor website and not actually aimed at informing and empowering teens.

    My bad for thinking otherwise.

    You guys are very funny and talented if not very informative.

    Good luck! Sadly. I must admit that at the expense of the millions of teens clicking on on your link who truly need quality sexuality education, I think you have a future.

    For any teens reading this….yes, Midwest Teen Sex is indeed funny but it isn’t helping in the effort to disseminate accurate information that, in reality, will help protect you.

    You might want to check out some sites that will such as:

  82. 82 brad

    “From beginning to end the video places the responsibility squarely on the shoulders of the teen victim”

    Sorry, I just dont see that in this video. You said that we should go after the abusers and not put the responsibility on the victims. I’m sure we all agree. I for one would clap with glee to see abusers like that beaten and dragged through the streets. But the purpose of this video is telling teenage girls how to avoid becoming a victim in the first place, and since some of them dont know it, explain to them when they actually ARE a victim. Truly, there are young teenage girls out there who think that it’s perfectly acceptable to date guy who are much older than they are. Britney’s impression of the dumb blonde girl is sadly, not too far off the mark of some of the teenage girls out there today. In the case of consentual statutory rape, it really does take two to make a victim.

    It’s the same principle as reminding someone to lock up their house so as not to get robbed. It’s not their responsibility if they DO get robbed, but they could have avoided it altogether if they had just been properly educated about security.

  83. 83 BACHE

    respectfully responding to Brad,

    First off this podcast is not educational. I learned that the hard way.

    And next,
    ‘the purpose of this video is telling teenage girls how to avoid becoming a victim in the first place, and since some of them dont know it, explain to them when they actually ARE a victim.’

    are you freakin kidding me?

    You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Go be an 11 year old incest/rape/ beaten female for a day and them come talk to me.

    “Truly, there are young teenage girls out there who think that it’s perfectly acceptable to date guy who are much older than they are. Britney’s impression of the dumb blonde girl is sadly, not too far off the mark of some of the teenage girls out there today.”

    and so..your point is..???? Are these less than mature or informed teens somehow responsible for the abuse they receive at the hands of another? sadly usually a man???

    I work with people who are in fact retarded. One aspect of my job is to empower these people against sexual abuse. But sadly, because they lack the ability to truly advocate for themselves sexual abuse is rampant. And it most often occurs at the hands of older males.

    My question to you is: Are you suggesting that one’s limitations to defend oneself excuses another’s abusive action against them?

    And let’s just say we are talking about someone who can’t advocate for herself. Maybe she is 11. Or maybe she is retarded. Where do you place the responsibility there?

    Abuse is abuse. I wish people would stop defending it.

  84. 84 brad

    Last time I checked, this wasnt an issue of people who were violently raped, It was about young girls who dont know the difference between a healthy relationship and an unhealthy one

    “My question to you is: Are you suggesting that one’s limitations to defend oneself excuses another’s abusive action against them?”

    No, absolutely not, and im not sure what i said to make you think that I did. I’m saying that some of these young girls dont know that theyve been victimized. They think that what has happened or is happening to them is normal, and it’s not. Theyre not responsible for what happened to them, not at all, but just because someone is older doesnt give them jedi-mid-trick-powers. What happened to them is WRONG, WRONG WRONG WRONG. But it’s also not entirely unpreventable. Are you advocating that we stop trying to teach people how to recognize and avoid these bastards, just dismiss these acts as bad luck, wait until theyre already victims and then go after the perpetrators? That was rhetorical. I know youre not, I’m just saying thats what im reading.

    And if they are 11, retarded, etc. The responsibility for the crime goes exacly where it always goes: to the perpetrator. I’m not defending abuse, i’m saying that it’s a good idea to try and not to have any at all. A world without abusers would be great, but unfortunately we cant have that, so at the very least we should try everything we can to keep abuse from ever happening. That’s what the message in the video is.

    If you see a blind person about to be tripped by an a**hole, It’s not their fault that they’re about to be tripped: Theyre blind, there’s notihng they could have done. It’s the a**hole’s fault. But if we see the a**hole and that theyre going to trip on their leg, is it also not our responsibility as decent people to tell them “hey, watch your step, that guy in front of you is an a**hole, and be careful up ahead ther’s a bunch more a**holes out there, so here’s a cane and a dog so you know when theyre coming up”

    If you didnt get the reference
    Blindnesss = Immaturity
    A**hole = pedophile
    Cane & Dog = education

    That’s all i’m saying, and that’s what i saw in the video. “Girls, dont date guys who are too old for you. Theyre just trying to trick you. And if you are dating one already, report him and stop seeing him before something bad happens.” If you missed that message in the video, you werent paying attention. i’m sorry if you misunderstood me, and if you still think i’m wrong and that i’m full of sh**, i’d like to know what your solution is, cause it must be great.

  85. 85 brad

    P.S. Im sorry for jumping into the conversation a little late, I should have read a little more detail into the previous posts. Kelev did an excellent job of expressing the exact same sentiments as my own before i even saw them. In fact, you can ignore about 95% of what i said, because Kelev already said it better.

  86. 86 BACHE


    It’s getting a little heated and really I didn’t mean to create that kind of conversation. I started it so I apologize. And while truly I do want to bow out I also respect that you took the time to respond so feel I should do likewise.

    I said in a earlier post that I whole heartedly agree with educating young people, male and female, about what sexual abuse is and how to best avoid it. Your comment about this conversation not being about violent rape sort of drives home my original point which was that not enough focus is being placed where I believe it needs to be, that being on educating men.(I say men because more often than not sexual abusers are men and their victims are women…I am fully aware however that young boys are also abused far too often usually by men as well)

    Whether it is gentle/friendly molestation all the way down the line to violent is all sexual abuse and therefore I fell we are talking about rape here. Just really nice rape.

    And the video doesn’t bother to address the abuser. It does what I see most of the time and that is focus solely on the abused.

    Let me see if I can at least squeeze a little value out of that word “cancer” by using it in an analogy.

    It’s kind of like what if we only treated the symptoms of cancer but never addressed the cause. What if we just waited until it was stage 4? We do that with sexual abuse. We simply throw the abusers in jail…and that’s only when we are lucky enough to identify them and get a conviction. Too little too late.

    Generally speaking I think we treat the symptoms of sexual abuse but spend pretty much zero time looking at how abusers are created in the first place. We spend an inordinate amount of time teaching self-defense, assertiveness, avoidance skills…and it’s all good…but it’s not going to do much in terms of stemming the tide of abuse.

    I don’t have a grand, broad scale solution but I do live with three men 9husband and two sons) so I focus my work there. I give them ongoing education about what constitutes abuse. I make them examine their own views about women and sexuality. I make sure they see how pervasive abuse it is and how the media encourages and cultivates abusive men and honestly sells men short in terms of how truly caring and respectful they can be towards others. I try to impress upon them the fact that any and all unwanted sexual advances constitute abuse…even an unwanted kiss on their girlfriend’s cheek. And abuser is grown, not born. It takes ongoing education as they grow up to ensure that they truly understand the roots of sexual abuse. And then I challenge them to set the bar high for men…get proactive to stop what’s going on. And they are proactive. So I guess my answer to you about what my solution is is just that. Education…and truckloads of it for the men. And I don’t see that happening except by a very few. In my earlier post I mentioned an extremely good site that does talk about abuse in the way that I see as being far more on target.

    I really hope you read it and would love to hear what you think.

    And again…the reason I sort of want to bow out of the comments on this site is simply because the site isn’t doing much educationally and that is what I was looking for.

    However, like they is not their intent…humor is. It is very funny. I think our bubblegum chewing girl may fast find herself on SNL. She’s brilliant! And I am looking forward to seeing where her career goes.

    Thank you for reading my long post and thank you for yours. I do hope you can get over to the website. It’s got great stuff.


  87. 87 BACHE

    apologies for the massive typos…sheesh!

  88. 88 brad

    Thank you for that post. After reading it, i’m seeing what youre getting at, and it is something I agree with. We DO need to teach young men what constitutes abuse, i’ll agree there are far to many young men out there who dont know what is and what isnt.

    I think what i was getting hung up on in undertanding your point was when you said “Focus on the ABUSER” When i read that, I think of focusing on someone who has already committed abuse on someone else, not someone who is at-risk to abuse because they dont know the difference. By the word “Abuser”, you mean “how could we have stopped him from becoming one”. In my mind, prosecution is secondary to avoidance. Anti-abuse rather than Counter-Abuse, and i’m sure you agree.

    However, after attending more sexual responsibility seminars for young men that i care to mention, I can honsetly say that some men just dont get it, and never will, and the very worst of which, the true predators, there really wasnt much that could have been done to stop them from becoming who they are. The most we can do at that point is try to identify them before they act (not very easy by itself, and without an act, impossible to prosecute), and to educate those at risk of being victims on how to avoid becoming them.

    But youre right. perhaps we do assume too much and give to much faith in people to believe that they know what is right and wrong to begin with.

    I’ve got a few more issue with what you said in your last post, but i’ll tell you what, i’ll knock it off for now cause that’s not something for everyone in the room to read, and it’s not my job to convince you.

  89. 89 Kelev

    Bache, I really appreciate what you’ve shared.

    This is a complex, nuanced issue. It goes without saying. Somehow, though, it bears repeating because you see far too many simplistic approaches when the topic comes up on TV, online, in the news etc. Perhaps the best thing we can do is always, always, always ask questions, remain humble, keep an open mind, and listen to each other with respect and charity.

    Everyone has a piece of the truth.

    How to stop abuse? How do we transform society to make abuse rare, or maybe even a thing of the past? No easy answers there, either. I truly believe, though, after my own sexual experiences and experimentation (some of which I’ve already mentioned above), and after years of researching what others have to say on the topic, that a society where sexual expression is free-er, unproblematic, where people are able to connect and share and experiment in an atmosphere free from guilt, shame, superstitions and taboos, such a society is much less likely to be a breeding ground for abuse.

    A huge amount of the abuse that occurs in many societies, past and present,`is the result of sexual repression, frustration and self-hatred. Interestingly, for example, a University of Georgia study a few years ago showed that men who were rated the most homophobic according to their own self-assessment, also displayed the highest degree of sexual arousal when watching Gay porn.

    This backs up anecdotal evidence like the testimony from the killers of Matthew Shepard that indicated they were struggling with their own repressed homosexuality at the time of the murder.

    In societies where people are shamed and guilt-ridden away from actualising their simple sexual/sensual desires, the sources and/or expressions of that desire become objects of pain, confusion, even hatred. People project and displace their self-hatred onto others whom they attack, rape, even kill. Or they kill themselves, like countless Queer youth, every day.

    When people are taught, from the time they are first able to form thoughts and words, that “those parts” are “dirty”, that pleasure is “sinful” and that sex equals humiliation, it’s no wonder that they will then use sex as a form of humiliation in the context of a violent, competitive rat-race.

    Just think of the terms “F*** you” or “I was f***ed”. They are synonymous with assault and insult. What’s up with that?!?!

    Think about it; f***ing is one of the most wonderful things folks can do together. Like I’ve said before, it’s the source of Life. We are all here because someone f***ed someone else, maybe a lot!

    But after thousands of years of equating sex and violence and sin (while also equating suffering and bloodshed with devotion and holiness) many societies are completely upside-down and backwards. We worship violence (sexual and otherwise) and demonise, even criminalise sexual pleasure. Backwards.

    Sex should be treated openly, honestly, intelligently and humanely. We should treat sex more like we do eating (not that there aren’t issues with eating as well, just not quite as many…). People should be encouraged to talk about what they like and don’t like, to cultivate the exotic, the fresh and the new, and to share with those they love, to invite others to share the pleasure, to feed but *never* force.

    Difference and variety should be celebrated and honoured. Sex, like eating, should be seen as an arena where there is endless variety to be enjoyed and explored. So long as it is healthy and consensual, no one should ever pass judgement on another, or at least no single form of expression should be privileged and enshrined while others are demonised and banned.

    That’s just a few ideas, for a start…

  90. 90 BACHE

    Brad…..thank you again. I think the conversation has been worth it even if there are still some points needing clarification. I do see that some futility exists in terms or expecting to eradicate abuse altogether. But I like to examine all the options and try anyway.

    And Kelev,


    I would say that you expressed my feelings and perspectives on the issue exactly. It might be more prudent for me at this point to retire to trolling and leave the articulations up to you guys who are really good at it.


    thought you might enjoy hearing that last night, as with many nights at our house…the dinner conversation was about “sex”.

    Three less male abusers for women to worry about here. And maybe even some advocates for stopping it. Fingers crossed.

  91. 91 Mari

    ah thanks for this video : )
    I hate it when girls i know (im 18) and have known have their older boyfriends and think they’re so amazing and that they themselves are so amazing for having older boyfriends when in the end, it’s really just sort of creepy. And they always think their “coolness” somehow makes up for the ten year age difference. Sorry, but no teenager is THAT charismatic. it’s not your “coolness” they’ve been attracted to…

  92. 92 Flyhalf_Keith

    Hi Nikol,

    Just watched a few of your clips online and during the episode about an older boyfriend I was reminded of something I’ve heard a number of times (including from my Dad):

    (your age x 0.5) + 7 = youngest age of a woman you should be dating.

    This was great when I was in Junior High because I could only date older woman.

    Though I’m now 36, I enjoyed your show a lot. Smartly done.



  93. 93 Ray

    Wow! Lots of thinking and discussing going on. Who would have thought…I would like to see a show on sex/power, the topic that Nicole alluded to via talking to Dr. Hersh. It brings to mind all sorts of other possibilities for shows, such as relationships that are abusive, recognizing a healthy relationship, maybe one on bondage and horticulture….

  94. 94 Stacy

    I am seventeen and i am dating someone who is 20 and I actually dont think its that weird..but is it?

  95. 95 Guy

    Stacy that’s not weird at all. This episode was meant to examine larger age/social differences, like a 15 year old dating a 25+ year old.

    Plus there are always exceptions. I’m a product of a 17 year age difference (granted my parents were well into their adulthood when they met).

  96. 96 cutthroat

    WOW! lots of feed back on this one! everyone is very defensive.. is it because they are insecure? probably. when i was 20 i made out with a 17 year old. hinesight made me creep out. im 27 and am in love with a 23 year old. our maturity levels are obvious. but i just KNOW he’ll grow up.. someday! would i have made out with him when i was 16 and he was 12? f’ NOOOO.. but now.. it really doesnt matter… and im still crossing my fingers that he’ll stop farting in my mouth to wake me up, just so he can finish maturbating on me..

    ps i live in one of those states that allows 3 years inbetween minors to be legal… as well as a law that says im not allowed to sit on a mans lap in public unless im married to him…. miss da mean her? hmmm.

  97. 97 dh

    I was going to recommend this site to several people but the cancer joke offended me too much. Sorry. If you remake the video there is probably some other good advice in this comment thread. I will link if this was edited differently.

  98. 98 dh

    Also, revver sucks. I’m trying to watch the videos on a congested line, and the video drops instead of stopping and restarting.

  99. 99 El Toro

    Seriously, they only made this cancer joke because they never had someone suffering from cancer in their families. Period.

    Anyone who had ever lost a relative to this disease would show more respect.

    Sorry guys, your website is cool, but this joke just sounded like you were not able to come up with anything better to say.

  100. 100 Dave

    You’re talking about guys in their 20’s having a “relationship” with a teen, what about us guys in their 40’s. Hell, I don’t want to have a relationship with a teen, just some “fun”. I’ve been married, don’t really want to go down that f-ing road again. If you know who some of these girls are give ‘em my email address.
    In all seriousness, I realize there are some girls that think it is more “mature” to date an older guy. The fact, is they are really showing the immaturity of their own thinking, believing that they are that mature, and that the older guy is the best thing for them.

  101. 101 Irritated

    Over all I like this show and this episode very much. Teenage girls should never go out with grown men, as it’s creepy, dangerous, and psychologically damaging. however, I disliked the reference to dating people with diseases. I was born with a serious immune disease that i will never be free of. My first love interest was recovering from Leukemia. If no one was ever willing to date the seriously ill in high school, my social experience, and those of my fellow sufferers of chronic illness, would be significantly more lonely.

  102. 102 ace

    lol i agree that a older person shouldnt have a sexual relationship with somebody under the age of 18 *or under the age of consent 16 in some states * but if they feel they really have a connection with this person,they should be more then willing to carry on a relationship with the said person WITHOUT having anytype of sexual actions past the point of kissing/Cuddling , Sex is not the only way to share and exlpore your feelings. If a guy/girl really loves there girlfriend/boyfriend should be MORE then willing to give up there phyical needs to explore a more emotional connection.

  103. 103 Katy

    i watched every other episode starting with 15 and working my way down. i’d like to put my two cents in….everyone else did.

    when i was 16 i was dating a 22 year old. sure it wasn’t the smartest thing i ever did, but it had nothing to do with his age. he was a crack head. enough said.

    also, my senior year in high school (age 17), i started dating this guy i was working with. he was 27: ten years my senior. why is it that the guy is the one with the disease? i think if anybody does, it’s me because i am still with that man today.

    and comparing these relationships to cancer isn’t funny. i see where the humor was supposed to be, but it didn’t happen.

  104. 104 H-Barbz

    Wow, Nimby, who pissed in your Cheerios? I’m 16. My boyfriend is 19. I know you wouldn’t say anything to my face in real life, but since this is the internet feel free to attack me. He isn’t (and has never) taking advantage of me in any way, indeed I initiated the relationship in the first place. We’ve been together for more than a year, and know each other quite well…it pains me that some faceless stranger is automatically judging my intelligence and his character, without ever meeting either of us you deem me a gullible airhead and him a dangerous predator. There was no need for you to call anyone an ungrateful brat for disagreeing with what can only be called a ridiculous ad hominem attack by both you and Nikol.

    Nikol, I like the show, love the idea, but try to be a little more open-minded. I understand you are trying to protect girls from being abused or taken advantage of, but your presentation of anyone with an even slightly older boyfriend as, well, a stupid slut, is more divisive than anything, and will likely embitter much of your target audience.

  105. 105 will

    look you clealry ‘connect’ pedophilia with cancer. this is a tasteless as well as totally inaccurate statement. strange you claim to be dispensing accurate advice to teens when in fact you are only advancing negative and incorreect steroytpes in this case about people with cancer.

  106. 106 Jazz

    Ha the stuffy dog wants girl/girl porn!

    I’m surprised at the negative responses.

  107. 107 Gabriele

    NO no no no no no! COMPLETELY YES! Stop fretting about certain thing, you PC hypocrites! Sure, this might leave some people feeling offended… But… what’s really less PC and more offensive: a 23 year old dating a 14 year old, or a short show that brings it into perspective long enough for you to think about it? Because, I was the 14 year old dating the 18 year old, and then I was the 14 year old dating the 23 year old. And, let me tell you, I don’t think these people make this show without experience or close insight. I’ve experienced most of the things they talk about my self, and, let me tell you, the older guy dating was one of the most horrible things in my life, but I had to be taken out of the environment in which I was doing all of this older male dating, to realize this (which is ironic, considering I moved from liberal town Colorado to Witch Hunt Small Town Kansas, but when I moved there, I saved a lot of girls from older perverts). Dating older guys leaves you feeling dirty for years to come, especially because those guys are usually losers who can only impress you with their ability to buy alcohol or their abilities to buy alcohol. They might throw in some D&D or something, but the don’t usually have any thing to offer that you can’t find at school with a simple monetary fee instead. Why suffer for years, if you can just buy what they offer, but guilt and sex free instead? Don’t whore your self out to older guys, because they make you feel bad for years to come. I’m 20, and I still remember how stupid my 23 year old was. And his stories. And his smell. And his sexual advice. And the thought of his old, wrinkled body over mine…. No, don’t do it, Please please please please please. It messes with you, it really does.

  108. 108 Ferenc

    First off, great job on the episode! It’s one of my favorites, for a few reasons. For one, it’s very humorous, and the jokes were very funny. Secondly, it brought up a rather heavy subject, in a comfortable and appealing way. Although the cancer line was a bit harsh, non-the-less, it was a joke in that of itself. I’ll agree that constructive criticism is good, but I don’t very well agree that some of the comments were as such. Id also like to point out, that a 20-23 year old dating a 16+ is not necessarlity considered pedophilia. in about 5 years, they will be 25-28 year olds dating 21+…and no one complains about them being pedos…
    [to contradict: however, i do not think its proper for a student still in high school, under the age of 18 to date someone out of college...unless that person is a genius and graduated early...]
    and further more, its basic biology to know as fact that women mature quicker than men do. so for a man in his early 20’s to date a girl in her late teens, is more like a couple at the same level of maturity. However, i think we can all agree that 30+ dating teens is highly considered as pedophilia[does this mean, however, that in the biblical era, that Joseph, being much older than Mary, is a pedophile?]

    i cant say ive had an older boyfriend/girlfriend, but i’ve seen it happen, first hand, and its not somthing to take lightly. being young myself, and hearing this from a friend, i wasnt sure what to do or say. basically my friend was abused by someone she considered close family. this man was in his 40’s…after telling me about things that went on between them, i obvserved that as a young woman, someone much older can make one feel secure and mature; it can even make one feel “Sexy” or “Atractive”; however, still naive, is then easily taken advantage of.

    In this case, this man played mind games, in that, he would comfort her when she was upset, then go down on her…being she was only 16, she was naive of the situation, and simply felt helpless to do otherwise. This man could easily overpower her, physically, and mentally, mind you, and was rather intimidating…
    thankfully, the relationship was abruptly ended when someone in her immediate family “woke her up” to the situation.

    the effects are lasting. she STILL feels resentment to herself, and some people around her. she’s still VERY angry. whether she says its for that reason or not, she still represses it. she is in couseling, however, it will still take a a while for the wounds to heal.

    and as for affending someone regarding the matter, i see only fit that someone diagnosed with cancer should be truely affended. otherwise, this podcast brings up the touchy subject in a way that gets you to truely think about the situation. if you’re in this sort of position, sure you can feel affended, ill give that much to you, but realize that if there’s too much space between your ages, then you need to bolt it outta that pairing, and find someone much closer to your age. its NOT healthy, and as it was said, it WILL leave you feeling dirty, violated, disgusting, and very angry for years to come.

    keep up the good podcasts MTSS!

  109. 109 Shannon

    I’m currently 20 and I am dating a man 16 years older than me. Does this make me a loser, stupid ninny or otherwise? Does this make him a loser. Have you ever thought that by the time a man comes to a certain age that all the other women have kids and these men don’t want a ready made family? I know I wouldn’t want that! Honestly, the guys my age have treated me worse than he ever has. He has a good job, his own place, and his life together better than most of my boyfriends. Of course, he’d never dare try to get a girl in high school. He made sure I wasn’t. He doesn’t want to stunt me and encourages me to go to college. He’s the best thing in my life right now and he’s being better accepted into my crazy family than my mother’s boyfriend.

    I’d rather have a decent upstanding older man who has never sexually harmed a child unlike a guy my age who once told me he sexually assualted a baby. I have never felt diry about dating older than I am. This is the only mad I have dated that waited till I was ready. He told me later, he could have made a move earlier but he decided to wait. With the trust we now have, he is so glad he did.

    I’m not proud of it. I don’t tell my friends because I know they will think less of me. There is a difference with a hot 5+ year old than a handsome 16+ year old. I’ve hardly spoken about it unless to my closest friends and have started to explain it. I’m not doing this cause it’s cool. I’m still with him because he means the world to me even if others think it’s gross.

    And evidently, my bad habits like cussing have gone down tremendously since dating him. lol

    Also, the cancer comment is utterly disgusting. Half my family have died from cancer and I don’t believe that any of their spouses should have left them cause of cancer. My whole life my uncle has fought cancer after cancer. His wife is still with him. 20+ years of struggle. He’s fought the good fight and seems to be winning. No one should dismiss cancer as an automatic death sentence.

  110. 110 Trooper6

    I get uncomfortable when people bring up puberty…i.e. girls mature faster them men…and it is natural to be interested in people who’ve had puberty…it is totally fine! And then they bring up the magic number of 16.

    But here’s the thing. Most girls aren’t hitting puberty at 16 any more. They are hitting puberty at 12. Some are hitting puberty at 9 and 10. So, is it okay to date a 12 year old because she’s post-pubescent and that’s all that matters?

    It isn’t just about whether someone has gotten their period. It is about all sorts of power differentials: life experience, income, independence, etc.

    And these numbers are relative…based on the power differential. 6 years doesn’t seem like a big age difference when one person is 36 and the other is 30…but it does when one is 20 and one is 14…even if the 14year old is post pubescent.

  111. 111 Karina

    I like the show. It’s more relaxed than most shows of this nature. Not everything is on target for me but overall great job! I just wish it was a little longer :)

  112. 112 scamps

    I <3 this episode! I found this at a great time, just before marrying my older fiance. We started dating when he was 23 and I was 17, just on the cusp of 18. Unlike most creeps, this creep was college educated, had a good career, and was overall very stable. All in all, it worked out great for us. But this doesn’t make me an advocate for such relationships. I feel that the majority of them are a big mistake.

  113. 113 Claire

    I love all of your videos, they’re hilarious. I think it’s really funny that people freaked out about the cancer joke, since I just showed this to my friend, who has cancer (coincidentally, I’m in the process of trying to convince him to date me), and we both laughed so hard we cried.

  114. 114 Lexxy

    haha. right on!
    i wish i would have seen this 2 years ago when i made the mistake of dating a 20 year old guy. worst experience of my life.

  115. 115 ur mom

    “and you wouldn’t date someone with cancer, would you?”..

  116. 116 Dylan

    I disagree with what you said here. Not all older guys are pervs or pedophiles. Some are, but many are not.

    The message here should have explained that if you really do find love with an older guy, you should wait until you’re eighteen. It seemed like you were categorizing every 18+ male as being a complete creep, which is simply very far from the truth.

  117. 117 Christina

    When I was 16 I started dating a guy who was 22. He still lived at home, had no job and was in community college. While I don’t necessarily think he was a loser (any other boy I would have dated at that time would have been living at home and not had job) it’s definitely weird to think about now that I’m almost 22. I would never date someone who was 16 and it makes me realize where he must have been at in his head.

    I’m not saying dating older guys is wrong: hell, I was with that guy for two years, but the fact is that if there’s too big of an age difference you’re going to get hung up on fundamental differences in big areas such as marriage, kids and careers.

    Thanks for making a video that addresses a topic that would have been good to hear about a while ago. If only current-sight was twenty-twenty, you know?

  118. 118 Anon

    Pedophilia is not a disease.

  119. 119 :)

    Not all of that is true, but it was funny, I’m 20 and i could be dating a 16 year old but it seems kinda gross. also shes a senior and going to be in college next year so it confuses me. :/

  120. 120 Haha

    When I was 17 I saw a couple of older boys (23-26), and now I am 21 and dating a 17 year old boy who I first started to see when he was still 16. Apart from not being able to see him on school nights it’s not much different.

  121. 121 Angela

    Damn. I’m a fourteen year old dating a sixteen year old and I thought that was bad. I was, am, a sheltered child.

  122. 122 sam

    I agree with this mostly except for the fact that i know someone who is 18 and in high school and dating a guy who’s 29 and they have a perfectly functional relationship. they’ve been dating since september and he hasn’t tried to make a move on her or anything. He understands that she isn’t comfortable having sex with him and he accepts that.

  123. 123 Julie

    Good Evening,

    I would like to respond to this video, and share my disagreement on various details, and statements mantioned. Firstly, I would like to kindly express my feelings about this video. I have never watched or followed any of these episodes: therefore I do not know what are the other episodes about, and I am only basing my conclusion and critics on this one.

    I strongly felt attacked and personnaly asaulted through this video. Making such generalization on such topic is rather unethical, than actually seen these relationship ocuring among these people.

    Lets have a look a America as a whole: We could also make some big generalizations: such as why are teenagers legally aloud to have sex, and work at the age of 16? but yet, they cannot drink until the age of 21-

    This episode seems to target young adolescents in America. ( I don’t think I am mistaken). The life in AMerica is far from life in other countries, and other cultures. In AMerica you don’t have aranged marriages, but yet, 16 years old kids drive, work, and live on their own.

    At this point of my reply, I am emphazising, generalizing, and concluding just like you have done in your video. ANother point I would like to elaborate on is the ” cancer part”. YOu should never, compare or affirm such statements.

    I actually watched this video sent by a friend of mine you suggested to me. I was keen on hearing further details to this topic: but got rather desapointed than thrilled. go chocked and mad with the various details and assumption made.

    a 16 year old girl dating a 20 year old man for example: you subtitle it: pedophily. ( Am right?)
    What about a 17 year old girl dating a 18 year old man: is that pedophily?
    what about a 19 year old girl dating a 23 years old man: is that pedophilly?
    Please let me know about your reasonning on these two questions: or rather change the subjects: why younger girls: could also be younger guys dating older female.

    thank-you for your understanding

    With Best regards,

    Miss Julie Janssen

    I beleive that the question of dating a guy, a man, or a married man older then the girl, the teenager, or the lady is a completely optional choice, and own peoples bussiness of taking care of themself. the law states one thing, and people do other things.

    As long as the law have moral, just and educational laws: I would be for the concerns and the worries of certain behaviours and relationships: in order to protect and assist teenagers, young adult,and the population.

    But I strongly disagree with Some rather unstable laws reagarding teenagers, and safety in America. Therefore I completely feel that this video was unadequate,and unhelpful. ( especially on the pedophilie part)

    If a teenager gets abused by a family member, or a older boyfriend? WHo to blame? not the man, nor the child…. its society. Are you saying its okay, for teenage girls to be raped by 4 of their classmates which are guys,and the same age? corruption and violence is and are in every background and every settings: no use of making exceptions.

    Please do not undersestimate this evaluation: but it is in Amercica that teenager and young children get influenced, unassisted, and less supported in growing up, and constructing a good future.

    thabk-you for your understanding

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